Discussion:
Why don't they make this: CFL insertion socket?
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TimR
2012-10-29 00:45:49 UTC
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Trying to get a CFL to work in a pole lamp triggered an unrelated idea.

(the lamp is European; apparently there is a difference between E26 and E27 fixtures that is just enough to make some brands of CFL work and others not. Wish I could figure out the right brand)

Anyway, there is no other way to screw in a CFL than by holding the tube itself. I just don't like doing that. It leaves finger dirt and oil on the glass, and while I've never broken one off this way it seems possible, especially unscrewing one that's been in the socket a while.

But, these are spiral shaped. It would be dead easy to have a screwdriver slot in the base that you could reach through the inside of the spiral tube. That would make insertion easier, and solve the problem of getting a broken one out of a socket.
Tomsic
2012-10-29 21:59:11 UTC
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"TimR" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:e1771173-ec6e-4553-bd54-***@googlegroups.com...
Trying to get a CFL to work in a pole lamp triggered an unrelated idea.

(the lamp is European; apparently there is a difference between E26 and E27
fixtures that is just enough to make some brands of CFL work and others not.
Wish I could figure out the right brand)

Anyway, there is no other way to screw in a CFL than by holding the tube
itself. I just don't like doing that. It leaves finger dirt and oil on the
glass, and while I've never broken one off this way it seems possible,
especially unscrewing one that's been in the socket a while.

But, these are spiral shaped. It would be dead easy to have a screwdriver
slot in the base that you could reach through the inside of the spiral tube.
That would make insertion easier, and solve the problem of getting a broken
one out of a socket.



Nice idea. Why don't you submit it to one or more of the major lamp
companies. They all have a "submitted ideas" desk for such things. They'll
warn you about patents, non-disclosures, etc. but some ideas do get
implemented. Also, you likely won't get any recognition or money; but you
might get some free lamps.

E26 and E27 bases are indeed very close in dimensions, but size tolerences
get to working and so certain lamps and bases are hard to get in or out. If
I have a tight base, a little silicone spray helps and it's best that you
use it before inserting the lamp.

Tomsic
m***@att.net
2012-10-30 02:31:40 UTC
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Post by TimR
(the lamp is European; apparently there is a difference between E26
and E27 fixtures that is just enough to make some brands of CFL work
and others not.
I have read, maybe in this newsgroup, that it sometimes works backwards
to what you would expect. I think this is the post I am remembering:

https://groups.google.com/group/sci.engr.lighting/msg/f96f2b558b761fc0?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect
Post by TimR
Wish I could figure out the right brand)
Or, find a local hardware store that also repairs portable fixtures.
The ones that do enough of it are used to putting US sockets in European
fixtures, including having (or making!) the right mechanical pieces to
get the US socket attached to the fixture.
Post by TimR
Anyway, there is no other way to screw in a CFL than by holding the
tube itself.
In some fixtures you can hold on to the plastic base of the CFL, but
for a lot of them, holding the glass is indeed easiest.
Post by TimR
I just don't like doing that. It leaves finger dirt and oil on the
glass,
Wear gloves or use a cloth?
Post by TimR
and while I've never broken one off this way it seems possible,
especially unscrewing one that's been in the socket a while.
FWIW, I've never had the glass of a CFL break while installing or
removing it. All of the glass failures have been due to some external
trauma: either it was an exposed ceiling fixture and somebody smacked
the glass with something, or it was a portable fixture that fell over
and damaged the glass.
Post by TimR
It would be dead easy to have a screwdriver slot in the base that you
could reach through the inside of the spiral tube.
A lot of the CFLs I've used (60 W to 100 W equivalent) seem to have air
vent holes (for the ballast) in the place where a slot like this would
need to go. They could probably be moved away from the center and still
work.

A possibly more interesting question is: what happens if somebody is
really enthusiastic with the screwdriver and pokes it through the
plastic? I think they are at least likely to damage the ballast, and
if they are really going for it, might manage to get the screwdriver in
contact with the center terminal of the socket, which is probably
sub-optimal.

Matt Roberds
TimR
2012-10-30 12:42:40 UTC
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Or, find a local hardware store that also repairs portable fixtures. The ones >that do enough of it are used to putting US sockets in European fixtures, >including having (or making!) the right mechanical pieces to get the US socket >attached to the fixture.
Yeah, but.

The quality of the sockets in these two pole lamps is an order of magnitude better than that of US lamps.

I do wonder about one thing. European voltages are twice the US, so the current is only half. That suggests the wire size is pretty small, one of the reasons I only use CFLs in them. There might be a safety issue here.
m***@att.net
2012-11-08 02:05:25 UTC
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Post by TimR
The quality of the sockets in these two pole lamps is an order of
magnitude better than that of US lamps.
Better-quality US sockets are probably obtainable.
Post by TimR
European voltages are twice the US, so the current is only half. That
suggests the wire size is pretty small, one of the reasons I only use
CFLs in them.
The line cord is probably OK. It has to be thick enough (both copper
and insulation) to handle normal household use, which is about the same
in both places. I have seen European lamp cord labeled as 0.75 mm^2,
which is between 18 and 19 AWG, and another popular "small" wire size
there seems to be 0.8 mm^2, which is just under 18 AWG.

If there are any short wires inside the fixture (like between a switch
and a socket), they might be made out of something thinner, especially
if they are protected by the body of the fixture.

If you have the adapter that turns a lamp socket into two 2-prong
receptacles and a lamp socket, screw that into the fixture socket, and
then screw a 100 W incandescent into the adapter. You can then
(carefully) measure the voltage drop between the wall receptacle and the
receptacle on the adapter with a multimeter. (Tape all but the last
1/8" or 3 mm of the multimeter probes with electrical tape if they
aren't already like that.)

Matt Roberds
TimR
2012-12-07 13:19:03 UTC
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On Wednesday, November 7, 2012 9:05:26 PM UTC-5, ***@att.net wrote:
If you have the adapter that turns a lamp socket into two 2-prong receptacles and a lamp socket, screw that into the fixture socket, and then screw a 100 W incandescent into the adapter. You can then (carefully) measure the voltage drop between the wall receptacle and the receptacle on the adapter with a multimeter. (Tape all but the last 1/8" or 3 mm of the multimeter probes with electrical tape if they aren't already like that.) Matt Roberds

That's.............genius! I never thought of that, great testing idea.
Stephen Furley
2013-12-25 11:35:24 UTC
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Post by m***@att.net
Post by TimR
(the lamp is European; apparently there is a difference between E26
and E27 fixtures that is just enough to make some brands of CFL work
and others not.
I have read, maybe in this newsgroup, that it sometimes works backwards
https://groups.google.com/group/sci.engr.lighting/msg/f96f2b558b761fc0?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect
Post by TimR
Wish I could figure out the right brand)
That post was from me, long ago. The first time I look at this group for
ages, the first thing I read is this.

From the few tens of lamps and holders which I've tried it does seem that
E27 lamps will fit E26 holders, but that many, but not all E26 lamps will
not fit E27 holders. The same applies to E40 and E39, but the difference
seems to be smaller here, and most E39 lamps can be made to work in a E40
holder, but they are sometimes a rather tight fit. I think the reason for
this is that the thread is shallower on the American versions.

Chinese made lamps, at least those not of the major brands seem to fit both
holders, even when they're made for the American market, and described as
being E26, or Medium Base.

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